UK/US Planning

Carolyn Hadlock, Creative Director at Y+L in the States emailed a question after reading our coffee topics.  She'd wondered if the US/UK part had any insights on the difference between UK and US advertising:

'I've always been a fan of UK advertising and have often wondered if it's the planning function, or the client or something else I haven't thought of yet that makes it what it is. If you have a moment to tell me what you talked about (and any other views you might have), I'd greatly appreciate it.'

Sadly our conversation on this topic was much too fluffy to have any serious bearing on any serious topic like Advertising, so I thought I'd open this question up to the field.  I know lots of people who have much better and clued up views than me on this, so I'd love it if you could chuck your 2 cents in, as it were.

For what it's worth, this is what I said.

Dipti and I were talking about how strange she found strangers' manner over here.  Like they'd say overly complicated things when less would do.  Or ambiguous things in mundane situations when a mundane thing would do.  Annoyingly I can't think of her example.  She had a good one (Dipti what was it?).  And I knew just what she meant.  It's not quite sarcasm (although there's a lot of that).  But it's overthinking things.  And it's also a desire to appear more than straightforward a lot of the time.  An embarassment about being simple perhaps.  I'd found in New York (the only US I've seen) that strangers were a lot more open and direct on the whole.

And then when you get people trying friendly directness here (like they try and make the staff at the Gap do) it jars a bit, when over there it seems natural.  With this kind of talk there are unavoidably horrible generalisations, for which apologies. 

Personally I think audiences like being made to feel clever in the UK, generally (can't speak for the US).  They like something to work out - that 'ah-haa' moment.  And a lot of the advertising has traditionally played to that.  Also I think there's a very serious, established planning function which is good in so far as it's respected and given time and resource; bad in that it's often far too separated from creative, and - according to some - not accountable enough.

That's my rough stab, which is pretty clueless.  I have an interview with David Hackworthy to get up on here soon, which talks about this, but David if you're reading would you mind having a go?  And I'm sure Russell has a lot to say about this having worked in Portland.  And anyone else, of course. 

Comments

[Jason Lonsdale]

As a Kiwi, I do find that the English do try to avoid directness -perhaps it is too blunt, perhaps even rude? (Often this makes for slightly tricky research groups...)

Americans always seem far more comfortable with bluntness -it is a much more thrusting culture, where straight-shooting is seen as a desirable attribute. Inevitably, this is reflected in their advertising, which can seem overly retail and shouty to the English.

Carolyn, there is a great book called "Watching the English" written by Kate Fox, an ethnographer/anthropologist. Its not an ad book, but is incredibly useful for insights into the English. Briefly, her hypothesis is that its all about "social dis-ease". Worth a read.

[dipti]

A caveat to this comment: I’m being a generalist!

The example: I was waiting for an elevator in London and when it stopped, the direction light didn't go on. I asked the 2 men in the elevator if it was going down. They said, "eventually." They were going up. In the States, that would be considered somewhat rude. I have a feeling they didn't mean to be rude, but why not answer a simple question with a simple answer? This kind of exchange has happened a lot in my 2 months here, and it’s tiring! By no means have I spent enough time here to understand the culture, but I’ve been collecting these anecdotes in the hope that I’ll get it!

Jason's point about Americans valuing straight-shooting is very accurate. Sometimes this directness is attempted by being overly polite - to complete strangers. I can understand why the super-friendliness may be interpreted as insincere or silly. But in the words of David Sedaris, “People aren’t as foolish as they are kind.” What amazes me about this behaviour is that it’s very easy to spot someone who is trying too hard to be clever or interesting! Just because something sounds complicated or takes a while to understand doesn’t mean it’s any more original or exciting… Americans fall into this trap as well.
Why not let natural intelligence and wit emerge at the right moment? Otherwise the conversation is filled with misplaced and unproductive sarcasm?

I'm also a fan of some UK advertising – it seems more clever, interesting, entertaining and less pushy. From my experience, the US has loads of legal restrictions on which lines ads cannot cross. We are the country that had people in arms over Janet Jackson’s wardrobe malfunction after all… But maybe the difference has more to do with population size and geography. While things are changing, many brands are still using 'mass' advertising in the US, and trying to reach an increasingly diverse population. Plus, if any of you have lived in a major city in the US, you recognize that the city cultures are distinct from the vast middle and distinct from each other. That said, the ‘mass’ ads that we see in the US are watered down and simplistic, and my opinion, underestimate Americans’ desire to be entertained and informed.

[Simon]

The US and the UK couldn't be more different - in some ways.

And, as a result, both coutries have produced some of the best work in the world.

At our best, the UK has the ability to do inference, subtlety and resonant advertising the likes of nowhere else - probably because we love figuring things out and the subtle undertones of communication.

However, when it comes to making a really simple point in a dramatic or humorous manner, the US wins every time. The UK simply doesn't do sngle-minded as well as the US.

Meanwhile, I'd agree with Jason that we are frighteningly rude over here. Going away to the US and returning made me realise that our love of debate and sarcasm can make us horribly rude. By contrast, the Americans (known for being brash) are far more straight-talking and sensitive. Personally, I think it's something to do with us losing some of our 'polite' inhibitions without gaining the US co-operative working ideals!

Hey ho.

[Charles Frith]

I'm looking into this subject right now and it's hugely complex, the variables go on ad infinitum but in a nutshell there are low context cultures and high context cultures. Cultures are paradoxical so that doesn't help much but as a sweeping generalisation some cultures just prefer an indirect method of communication. It's considered almost rude to address the question at hand directly. That's why meetings in Japan are not about decision making but more about formally agreeing that what has been reached as consensus outside of the meeting is concluded formally. I could go on but my brain hurts. :)

[Will]

I think the point you raise about UK audiences liking to feel clever is the crux of it all.

Anything which is engaging on more than one level (the John Smith's Peter Kay work or much of the VW being a prime example) is highly lauded.

It's funny what Simon says about debate and sarcasm making us appear rude. The first time I visited California, I was CONVINCED that they were all being intensely sarcastic, that no-one could be that pleasant.

But no, they all really wanted me to have a nice day. Contrast that with the average UK salesperson, who can (uniquely) imbue that same sentence with the same force as 'crawl into a gutter and die'. Heh..

[chadlock]

Dipti- I talked with someone in the US who shared a similar theory- that of geography and population density. if you miss in the US, you miss BIG. The risks are too risky.

Here's a question for all of you in the UK- do you creative test?

[David]

I am always perplexed at the debate over US/UK planning. We all know Brits and Yanks are different as consumers; and as planners fundamentally represent the voice of the consumer in the agency, they should naturally be different.The arguments seem somewhat marital to me.....the Brits can't
understand why the Yanks aren't more like them and vice-versa.
As an Aussie who spent 10 years in the states and who now lives in the UK,I
have spent a lot of time around planners from both sides of the pond.The British planners I work with are fucking smart,
surprisingly analytical, and hate being exposed for weak thinking. They are far more likely to do their planning in and around the creative work,and avoid big assumptive
brand ideas like the plague (at least that is the classic Oxbridge model of planning).American planners vary wildly in style and substance in line with
scale and cultural differences that exist across such a vast country. At their best, they are very open minded and focused
on big brand ideas that can work their way into all manner of channels and consumers.
These are obvious gross generalisations, but for my money, a mix of orientations always works best for me in a planning department,so I would like to see more Yanks over here to match the sea of Brits in the US.
We spend most of our lives trying to make the mundane look interesting, and having different points of view seems to be at
the heart of how planners add value. So I'd ultimately say,if some planner wanged on at me about how either country was better than the other, I'd lose interest very quickly.

[chadlock]

david- I agree with you. the cultures are different and so are the staffs (within each culture) but why do the planners in the UK seem to be more vested in the creative work than planners in the US (gross generalization, I know) there are always exceptions, but I have to say I haven't met a planner yet who doesn't tolerate weak thinking. Is it that planning has been around longer in the UK than US?

[dipti]

i don't think that planners are less vested in creative work in the US, but i do think that in many agencies there planning is still relatively 'new' or evolved from a market research department. that said, planning isn't always as integrated into the rest of the agency and makes planners have to work twice as hard to establish themselves. lots of politics!! on the other hand, in companies where planning has a stronghold the stage is set for planners to be more influential and involved in the creative process.

david - while i would agree that british planners and american planners are different from a culture point of view, i would highly doubt that planners in the uk don't vary in style and substance as much as the american planners!!

it would be daft to say that one country has 'better' planning than the other of course. i think we have a lot to learn from each other!

[mark]

Despite being a Brit planning working in the US, I have never worked in UK advertising so can only gaze from afar.

In terms of Americans being with bluntness, I'm afraid I have to disagree (at least in a work context). Isn't this the land of "have a nice day"? If anything, the Oxbridge tradition of allowing disagreement for the sake of improving an outcome or having a debate is often woefully absent.

I do feel there is a market for advertising that makes the audience feel smart over here (not sure how big it is though). The difference on why you may see less of it may well have to do with US corporate views on how advertising works. It feels like the US pays much less attention to new research on advertising research than the UK does - there is no Admap here for example and little academic interaction. Brand managers, who have MBAs, get a very academic and often outdated education on the subject. This often leads to a more 2x4 approach to what they want from agencies.

There will always be differences in what works and what doesn't in terms of practicing planning - different creative and consumer cultures make that necessarily the case. But in terms of the way we think, I would guess that the differences are few and far between.